DISQUS

Film School Rejects: Boiling Point: 3…2…1… Re-Launch

  • Jake · 11 months ago
    The script that made Tom Jane leave was scrapped by the time Lexi Alexander signed on.

    From what I've read, this movie, like The Incredible Hulk before it, will feature an abridged origin retelling. If you dig deeper you'll see that it was handled a lot better than people say it was, despite the rumours.

    I'm looking forward to it, with no bias against Tom Jane's "urban western" Punisher.
  • Brent Peconi · 11 months ago
    I think the only issues I had with the Punisher was the room mates.. I felt they didnt really add much but a tad of humor to an otherwise dark, revenge driven film.

    I was hoping for the Ghost Rider film to have Tom Jane cast as a sup plot character with an eventual lead up to Punishers Sequel - allowing for a true Marvel Vs film to be created. Nic Cage vs Tom Jane.. I doubt the sweetness needs to be explained.

    Now with this film coming out - all those ideas have been squashed, and we get another revenge driven story, that probally wont be humanized as much as Janes role attempted.

    Not too thrilled - but then again - look at all the indy style flicks Jane has done instead.. im not whining at all.
  • Charles · 11 months ago
    Superman begins could take the Hulk route with a five minute origins recap running behind the the opening titles...
    Actually it should follow Action #1 which had a single page origin and leapt into action from the second page with an adult Superman.
    That would be my preference
    Unlike Batman Superman doesn't need to go through years of training, he wakes up puts on his super suit and smacks up wife beaters. that 30's vibe was gritty, Superman can learn on the job, we could have him start leaping then flying. He could be forced by the events of the movie to dig deep and become more super by the end,
    Leave the alien origin stuff untouched and bring it in for a Superman vs Star Wars sequel
  • Davebaxter1989 · 11 months ago
    I enjoyed Superman Returns. But I see what your saying about relaunches but anything that brough Casino Royale and Batman Begins get's some leeway in my opinion.
  • Andrew · 11 months ago
    Can't agree more. Especially about Superman, EVERYONNNNNE knows the origin story. We don't need a retelling or a reimagining.
  • Nevernude · 11 months ago
    I dont particularly care about the Punisher so i dont give a rats ass how many times they see fit to relaunch the franchise.
    Superman, on the other head, must not be relaunched. I vote for the next superman to be a sequel. Sure, Brandon Routh can be replaced as the Man Of Steel, because in my opinion he was very forgettable. There was no virtuoso performance delivered, like Christian Bale as Batman, or Robert Downey jnr as Iron Man, or Ed Norton as Hulk. Im not sure if it was his intention or he was told to play Superman like Christopher Reeves..but he just didnt own the role.

    So! dont relauch, just do a hulk 5 minute intro and then jump into a supes story involving DOOMSDAY!!!!
  • RobertFure · 11 months ago
    I'm definitely going to see War Zone. I love Frank Castle and the Punisher. But my hopes aren't all that high. I think it looks like it might be a good action movie but that it's going to be too stylized rather than gritty like my favorite line of Punisher books, the MAX Series.

    As for the script, it was constantly being rewritten until like 2007, when Jane left. In 2007 John Dahl turned down the script, saying it was bad. In 2008, writer Sutter withdrew his name from the script as well.

    That said, I'll be seeing it this weekend and giving it a 10 and 5 review. Hopefully it will rock my face off and we get more badass Punisher movies.
  • RobertFure · 11 months ago
    Yeah, the roommates were kind of hit or miss,though I didn't mind them that much, simply because I had read the Welcome Back Frank storyline that had featured them. The Jane version was in development before MAX really took hold of Punisher, so they worked with what they had.

    You've got a point about Jane - he has been doing some cool stuff elsewhere. Anyway, again, here's hoping for a good Punisher flick.
  • Sean · 11 months ago
    They are "re-introducing" Superman, but everything points toward Routh retaining the role. That is the right move.
  • Random-Man · 11 months ago
    Everyone go see Punisher: War Zone!!! Because if we don't we'll have to watch his family getting killed 3 times in a row just with a different actor playing Frank Castle.
  • Arou101 · 11 months ago
    I think a new Superman reboot would rock, especially if it was good. It doesn't need to be as dark and gritty as Begins/TDK, but it needs to have a better script than Returns... they went ahead and made that disaster without even telling the public that it was a sequel to Superman 2 (?). They told the public in interviews, but didn't exploit it in advertising, so most people were in the theater scratching their heads. I feel bad that Spacey had to be attached to such a tragedy. Although, I will admit, the plane/baseball field sequence was good.
  • Nish · 11 months ago
    Relaunches are needless in cases where the origin story has already been well established, such as Supes and the Hulk. It seems that movie studios are also taking on the bad habits of comic book houses and trying to constantly re-invent a character when it doesn't earn them enough money.
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    For petessakes, Robert. They're not retelling the origins. He's been at it for years when the movie opens up. How can it be a retelling of the origins? You just see flashbacks of his dead family; you KNOW this. Oh, and his REAL family, not FIFTY of them at a BBQ to better STRESS that he "lost his family". Please put down the Jane doll.
    Plus, you don't even know the miscast crappy movie you love. It wasn't in Miami; it was in Tampa Bay.
    The truth is: Thomas Jane deserves to have more roles. He's an excellent actor. And perhaps, if the 2004 Punisher even REMOTELY resembled the charaterization of The Punisher universe, then MAYBE I could agree that he had done a good job portraying Frank Castle.
    But it didn't and I can't.
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    I remember giggling at 1989 Punisher after seeing it. I thought the opening mafia wipeout scene was great, the shotgun scene at the docks was excellent, the fight scenes were finely choreagraphed, the bad guys were cool, that it was VERY brutal. But silly. Little corny too. Definitely not the REAL Punisher.
    In hindsight though, I consider it to be TEN TIMES better than the 2004 Slap in the Face to Punisher Fans.
    I apologize for being so black'n'white on this but ANY who say different are NOT Punisher fans and truly, have not read enough of the publication.
    Let one who has assure you: War Zone looks FANTASTIC. I weep in gratitude.
    Peace.
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    Oh! Almost forgot.
    Dolph's M-60 scene!
    C'mon! That part was better than the WHOLE Jane movie.
    Yes or no?
    Peace
  • Cole_Abaius · 11 months ago
    Let's be honest. It's not the characters - of course they are going to continue making movies about Superman, etc. It's just a matter of timing. Just like 9/11 jokes, rebooting these franchises is just too soon.
  • RobertFure · 11 months ago
    Seriously? They had Frank Castle squatting nude in a sewer. What did you hate so much about Tom Jane's version of the Punisher? I've read plenty of Punisher. The 2004 story was an origin. Yes it changed things. No, it wasn't necessarily for the better. But after the family massacre, it showed Castle dismantle someone completely, every aspect of his life and then he took his life. And I still maintain that the last 15 minutes were pretty perfect.

    As for not reading enough material, read "Welcome Back Frank" and that era of Ennis books, as much of the story is right off those pages.

    All my negative thoughts aside, I really am hoping for a great Punisher: War Zone. I don't blame anyone working on it for the road its taken. But I did legitimately enjoy the 2004 version as an origin and had high expectations for a dark and gritty *follow-up* that would be more in line with the last 15 minutes of the film, like Jane indicated.
  • Jake · 11 months ago
    I was also originally not too optimistic about it, but these clips: http://www.blackfilm.com/20081113/features/punish...kind of puts some perspective on my mind-changing.

    This one might actually work.
  • Davebaxter1989 · 11 months ago
    I'm sure I commented saying Superman Returns is pretty good did that get deleted? Man someone hates Superman Returns haha
  • TL_is_now_TJL · 11 months ago
    Please, not another Superman reboot. Superman Returns was enough torture. I know Warner Brothers doesn't want to hear this because everyone cashed in on Superhero movies this past summer, but wait a few years before trying another Suprman movie.
  • RobertFure · 11 months ago
    I've read anything from The Punisher to Punisher War Journal to Punisher War Zone to Punisher: Purgatory and of course, the Punisher guest spots in other comics, even following him so far as The 'Nam and the Punisher + Nick Fury video game. Out of all those, Ennis' work on the MAX line (of which I've read every issue and every spin-off)is by far my favorite, though there are of course memorable moments before that. "They always aim for the skull."

    Now that we've finished measuring our rifles, I guess it's safe to say we we're in no danger of agreeing on the Punisher's past film appearances. Though I'm still waiting for anyone here who can convince me the 1989 film is superior to the 2004 one. I merely say again - naked crouching in sewers. Though I may have just been inspired to figure out some sort of Punisher article that spans all three films.

    I look forward to this Punisher conversation continuing this weekend after we all see War Zone.
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    "Intimidation"
    Sorry.
    Last thing: Even though both films were PG-13, Dolph FOLLOWED THROUGH on the torture (the rack). Jane pansied with the lollypop scene. I know that it follows Dixon's War Zone, but ultimately, years later, as we all know, Castle blows him up in his garage. So the bottom-line is that, one day, Castle was GOING TO KILL Fondozzi. But not Jane.
    Jane's not a killer, plain and simple.
    Peace
  • RobertFure · 11 months ago
    I didn't find a rating for the 1989 film, but the 2004 was given an R-Rating, not PG-13. As for the Dolph vs Jane, most of the points were on their appearance, not their movies. But yeah, I do wish the 2004 version was more violent, but I appreciate origin stories. As for Punisher in the sewer, I'm not mad he was in the sewer. I was pointing out that he was fully nude meditating in the sewer, not hiding or stalking prey.
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    First off, I gotta say that though Robert and I disagree, he's always expressed himself with maturity and class and his views on the character, though a little indulgent, are not without relevance and merit. His opinion is important and I thank him for sharing it with me.
    To the matter at hand: The squatting in sewers? I got that beat. Jane's drinking. Boom. That's FAR more transgressional to the storyline. Yes or no? Checkmate.
    We SAW Punisher in the sewers. LOTSA times. In the Ennis storyline, the Aim Low issues, the Vengeance issues and the Slavers issues off the top of my head. NEVER saw him get hammered. Especially not "a lot" like Mystique says.
    Cool?
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    In the "First Look" page, Robert starts off with a mad hate-on against any new non-Jane Punisher. NO ONE knew anything about the flick but Robert's bias is PALPABLE. Granted, he softened up DISTINCTLY once the red-bands came out and now sees that this movie juuuust might be pretty dang good. So at least, there's that. But did he find my posts where I CLEARLY express why Dolph was better?
    I think Stevenson is MASTER of The Punisher role in comparison to Dolph and Jane after seeing a cumulative grand total of what?, 5 mins screen-time, but this is Dolph vs Jane.
    Here's why: Dolph had a hard, chiseled face. Jane's face is doughy. Dolph was BIG. Jane ain't big. Dolph already benifitted from a bad-ass legacy, "Black Star", "A View to a Kill" (gotta look closely) and of course, the pièce de résistance "Rocky IV". Jane fought a shark...and couldn't save the girl.
  • Bugss · 11 months ago
    Put those together and you have: Intimadation Value. Dolph had some. Jane had none.
    Frank Castle is the scariest person on the planet. I laughed when Mystique's boyfriend advances "menacingly" on Jane. NO ONE advances menacingly on Castle, let alone a 5'10 punk wih a switchblade, AND LIVES! Remember the "Welcome Back" series? When the junkie mugger pulls out a knife? The look on Castle's face?
    "Well. It's not much. But it'll have to do." Feet stickin' out of a garbage can next panel, not tapped on the head and told to get lost.
    Jane could never portray Intimadation, even disregarding the fact that he doesn't resemble Castle in the least.
    I'm not saying Dolph was the spitting image but he DID have Intimadation Value.
    "Every day the children are gone is going to cost you money."
    FUMPA-PUMPA-PUMPA-PUMPA-PUMPA!
    Cool?
    Peace
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    I answered your e-mail, Robert, so no point repeating everything now.
    Maybe another REAL Punisher fan would like to set Mr. Fure straight as to why, though a little bit corny, Dolph's Punisher rules LORDINGLY over Jane's?
    And seriously, Robert, check out my other posts in the other chapters of your, and Neil's et others' Punisher blog listed up-top.
    Cuz though Ennis' characterization of Castle is enough to get your teeth wet, us True fans know that Baron and Dixon, to name the most visible, had QUITE a bit of input on the guy. There's HISTORY there. Us True fans KNOW who Castle is as a result. We KNOW Castle, and Tom Jane, Mr Fure, sir, is NO Frank Castle.
    And should you decide to take the plunge I defy you to take, I GUARANTEE that one day, you will TOTALLY agree with us.
    Top to bottom.
    Peace
  • Bugs · 11 months ago
    Wrong. He WAS stalking prey. Just psyching himself for the task, is all.
    Ok, now I'm pushing it.
    Did you see the reviews I copied, Robert?
    Got 2 more on the "15 pics" page.